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Speer 165 gr btsp

19 Nov 2016
@ 09:22 am (GMT)

Arve Ringsbye

Anyone have any experience with this bullet?

I am starting load development for a lightweight rifle in 300 wsm.

Lookink for a allround hunting load for mule deer, caribou, out to 750-800 yards.

Also plan to load for a dual load with the Nosler e-tip 168 gr for close range work out to 300 yards.

Replies

1
19 Nov 2016
@ 07:04 pm (GMT)

Nathan Foster

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
Hi Arve, that is just a bit too far for the Speer BTSP, it cannot expand at your max ranges. If you go back to the Cartridges book, you'll see its general limits.

All the best.
20 Nov 2016
@ 10:54 am (GMT)

Arve Ringsbye

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
I was afraid of that. I offered the catrigde book to a friend of mine two years ago. He is a long range shooter, but had some issues about bullet selection for long range hunting. Guess I'll just have to order myself the book once more😄

What about the nosler 168 gr bt, at 1900 fps at 700 yards?

Again also this bullet will be fine as a dual load with the 168 gr e-tip with same poi out to 300-350 yards.

I will be thankfull for any suggestions here, before starting load development. Because of the lightweight platform I'm trying to keep bullet weight to max 168 gr. I'm well aware that increasing to 180 gr bullets this probably won't be any problem.
20 Nov 2016
@ 07:07 pm (GMT)

Nathan Foster

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
I have become so accustomed to customers / readers shooting light weight .300 WSM's that I assumed that this was your goal, looking for a sweet spot at around 2900fps, much like a hot .30-06 without pushing recoil too far. I crunched the numbers yesterday at both low and high nodes just to be sure.

The simple answer is the 168gr A-MAX / ELD-M. This takes away the need to chase velocities in this particular rifle / cartridge combo. There is simply no point trying to break 3000fps if the rifle is uncontrollable at this speed and also no need.
20 Nov 2016
@ 08:31 pm (GMT)

Arve Ringsbye

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
Thanks Nathan!

I'll give one of those two a try.
21 Nov 2016
@ 12:13 am (GMT)

Luke Lahdenranta

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
I just noticed the last time I checked the Speer website that it looks like all the BTSP bullets are no longer listed. I wonder if Speer is dropping them? I don't know what's going on with Speer these last few years dropping lots of good bullets, it seems like they aren't interested in the reloading market anymore?? Too bad, I like quite a few of their bullets but they have been hard to find a consistent supply as of late.


http://www.speer-bullets.com/products/rifle/hunting/hot_cor.aspx
21 Nov 2016
@ 09:07 am (GMT)

Arve Ringsbye

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
No problem with supply of the btsp here in Norway, but might be vast storages.
Initial testing yeasterday gives me a mv of 3100 fps with the 165 gr btsp. Anyway I think I'll follow up on Nathans advice so have ordered some 168 gr amax.
21 Nov 2016
@ 06:37 pm (GMT)

Bob Mavin

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
I've been shooting Fallow to big Samba Deer with 168 Zombie Z-Max (same as A-Max) out to 700yds for some time now at 2900fps, I couldn't be happier, not one failure.
22 Nov 2016
@ 01:57 am (GMT)

Ben Law

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
Quote:
I've been shooting Fallow to big Samba Deer with 168 Zombie Z-Max (same as A-Max) out to 700yds for some time now at 2900fps, I couldn't be happier, not one failure.


That's interesting to know Bob.
What is the closest range you have used these on the sambar?
22 Nov 2016
@ 04:32 am (GMT)

Bob Mavin

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
Hi Ben
About 170yds, went straight through both shoulders 3/4" exit wound. My favorite high forward shoulder side on.
I've shot about 200 odd Deer with them, mostly Fallow, big Reds, Rusa & Samba. Only one projectile has stayed in, that was a Fallow at 550yds, front point of the shoulder, through the heart & lungs, gut/paunch & hip found it under the skin at the back of the ham weighing 124gns and looking like a Remington Core-loc mushroom add. Here's a big Rusa exit hole at 150yds, smashed through the shoulder joint on the impact side. 168 Z-Max is the only pill I use in my 30-06 love it!!!

V
22 Nov 2016
@ 04:33 am (GMT)

Bob Mavin

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
22 Nov 2016
@ 07:34 am (GMT)

Ben Law

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
Thanks for that Bob.
Thats amazing performance from this bullet.
22 Nov 2016
@ 08:31 pm (GMT)

Martin Taylor

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
The 168 Z-A max is an excellent pill as Bob has said, using it out of the 308 from 10-650 yards on game with terrific results and is also the only pill we now use on small-med game with that cal. I wouldn't hesitate to use it out at 600 on heavy game either but only under good conditions with correct shot placement.

We have had slightly different results to Bob out of the 308w. Many pills haven't exited but produced extremely large amounts of internal damage, including deliberate placement through both shoulders on Grey Roo's from 100-350 yards. (sorry again for not taking pics Nathan!)
They have run .5 moa & better in every 30 l have tried without fuss both 1:10 & 1:11 including magnums. Great little pill!!

Back to the original post;
I'm about to load them for a mates 300 wsm as a general purpose load also to help keep recoil manageable for plinking, so should be interesting. I have that rig set up with 180 PP Woodleigh's as a bush load though and its a great combo!

22 Nov 2016
@ 09:19 pm (GMT)

Bryan Webster

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
Quote:
I just noticed the last time I checked the Speer website that it looks like all the BTSP bullets are no longer listed. I wonder if Speer is dropping them? I don't know what's going on with Speer these last few years dropping lots of good bullets, it seems like they aren't interested in the reloading market anymore?? Too bad, I like quite a few of their bullets but they have been hard to find a consistent supply as of late.


http://www.speer-bullets.com/products/rifle/hunting/hot_cor.aspx


I found the BTSP Spitzers there:

http://www.speer-bullets.com/ballistics/default.aspx?caliber=6&usage=0&brand=0&firearm=1
22 Nov 2016
@ 10:41 pm (GMT)

Luke Lahdenranta

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
Thanks Bryan, I followed that link and found the Speer btsp listed. That is good news indeed, I may put either or both the 165 and 180 gr bullets on my list to try in my 30-06 this winter... if I can actually find them on a store shelf here in BC.
22 Nov 2016
@ 10:51 pm (GMT)

Bob Mavin

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
G'day Martin.
I wonder if the Z-max is harder than A-max? I haven't used A-max only bought the Z in bulk when they were cheap at Cleavers, 4 boxes of 500. Wish I bought more.
That Rusa above was hit on the front point of the shoulder knuckle and the exit was not much bigger than the entry. The pill in the photo smashed the front shoulder & opposite side hip joint.

I cull a lot of critters including Pigs, I aim for the Hilar shot, level with the front of the leg slightly above halfway, a lot of bone but only recovered one pill.

I with you on Woodeigh's for big game
22 Nov 2016
@ 11:09 pm (GMT)

Andrew Murray

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
I thought the Z-max was just the A-max with a green tip?
23 Nov 2016
@ 01:09 am (GMT)

Bryan Webster

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
Quote:
Thanks Bryan, I followed that link and found the Speer btsp listed. That is good news indeed, I may put either or both the 165 and 180 gr bullets on my list to try in my 30-06 this winter... if I can actually find them on a store shelf here in BC.


My .308 as well as my son's 300 WSM love the 180 grain Speer BTSP.
We can each do better than 1/2 inch five shot groups at 200 yards given no wind to mess bench shooting up. They also perform well at some distance on elk but for the .308 I am using 165 grain Nosler Partitions.
23 Nov 2016
@ 01:46 am (GMT)

Martin Taylor

Re: Speer 165 gr btsp
Yep same pill Andrew.
I have cut them up to compare and shot them together (Nathan has to), no difference. We where surprised to see the lack of exit on such a light framed animal but the damage was extensive and immediate. Changed the mind set of the guys using small calibres with the same placement.

I brought the Zmax bulk same time as you Bob from Cleavers but also have the Amax's. I'm keeping my last 500 for game only and have just started plinking/training with the 155 hbc's from Darwin.

I can see merit in the Eld-x but haven't the money or time to test them just yet. Possibly a better option for a Magnum if something solid or with big teeth stands up in close given the 168 grain max being asked for.
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