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Forum Index > Rifles general discussion > Ethics of Using Match Bullet

Ethics of Using Match Bullet

23 Feb 2018
@ 10:31 am (GMT)

Luke Onderko

If one more person tells me I'm in unethical hunter for using ELDM or TMK bullets on game and that you need to "use the bullet for what its designed to do" i may end up in prison.

anyone else banging their head against a wall?

Replies

1
23 Feb 2018
@ 11:06 am (GMT)

Nathan Foster

Re: Ethics of Using Match Bullet
Well, you are developing a view of the whole picture while others have only a part of the picture. Unfortunately it takes a good deal of time and effort to develop the deeper understanding that you have obtained.

The same can be said of rifle designs and shooting methods. Unfortunately, until such things are pressure tested, it is difficult to understand the subject entirely. Also, we require duality. We cannot test x versus y if the gun stores, youtube, blogs, gun rags etc only offer us x. Most folk in this game don't realize that y actually exists. It can therefore prove very difficult to educate people under these conditions. It is impossible to force education or change onto others. Those who want to learn will learn.

But yes, there are many readers here who are in agreement with you. We have all been taking turns at being frustrated by current trends etc.
23 Feb 2018
@ 11:55 am (GMT)

Martin Taylor

Re: Ethics of Using Match Bullet
Never ends Luke..............never........

Remember not that long ago many Match/Target style projectiles just pin holed through or blew up on game at all sorts of ranges & these results (or hearing of) stick in the minds of many & they wont see it any other way!

Using these styles of projectiles had to be carefully explored/tested (insert TBR here) and Nathan/Steph have ruffled many feathers with honest, realistic published results fore & against.

The Amax/Eld-m and now the TMK have really opened up the abilities of these pills when matched to velocity, body weights etc.

Wait until you get called another one of those "IMMORAL, LR magnum shooting American sniper wannabe's!" I rarely mention LR game shooting in open conversation, other than in these pages.

24 Feb 2018
@ 04:47 am (GMT)

Luke Onderko

Re: Ethics of Using Match Bullet
Great stuff guys, just had to vent a little bit! Its amazing how people with such superficial knowledge can have such strong oppinions
24 Feb 2018
@ 05:12 pm (GMT)

Warwick Marflitt

Re: Ethics of Using Match Bullet
People believe what they want to believe. How many people know and understand the difference between a Truth and a belief. You can believe whatever you want to convince yourself too believe! Or just follow the crowd!!!! Do Green men abduct you into their frying sauces and probe you without your permission? Belief or truth.... A truth is just that. .... True. For example..... If you take an egg and drop it on the ground it'll break and as long as you keep dropping eggs you're going to keep breaking them. True? Lazy minds find easy solutions. If you let people think that they're thinking they'll love you. If you challenge them, making them uncomfortable to the point that they have too really Think!!! They're going to hate you.
Having the will to have and possess a will and stand up for the truths in life and this world, isn't the easiest thing to do. Mark Twain has some great ideas and sayings of such things and deeds. Stupid is what stupid does! Hey man "Stop being a dick". Could be used in response to someone's unthoughtful use of a belief system based upon emotion rather than carefully processed thoughtful testing and experiment gathered information. What's so wrong with Truthful results from real life testing. The dumbing down of the species serves little to promote our survival or strengthen our Forecesters position in life? What will it take ?
25 Feb 2018
@ 04:51 am (GMT)

Lane Salvato

Re: Ethics of Using Match Bullet
I've often wondered if a lack of hunting or shooting experience could be somehow mathematically equated to strong opinions that are as Warwick said, 'based upon emotion'?

I'm in love with the 25 caliber and was intent on becoming a long-range shooter with a 257 Weatherby. Nathan flat out told me that this wouldn't be the best idea because of the BC of the 25 and the weight of the projectile. I was disappointed to hear this but after reading his books, and articles it became clear to me that I'd be pouring good money after bad.

This forced me to confront something that is more prevalent now than ever before and that's recoil sensitivity. I remember that this was the hardest lesson because if you string his comments together in the books, he's telling you that your rifle stock sucks and you don't know how to shoot. I mean that's it. Monte Carlo stock and bad technique. So, the caliber won't work for long range, my rifle is the wrong setup, and my shooting technique is questionable at 48 years old. Lovely.

I've been convinced by marketing in the gun media that solid copper bullets are the only way to go. I'm sold on them. Then I watch three animals run away all shot with solid copper bullets. I go back and read the books again and it's all there in black and white. Soft bullets are more versatile. They kill faster.

Having both hunting and shooting experience enabled me to work through this process and unlearn some preconceived notions based mostly on outdated sources of knowledge, marketing, and old wives tales. Experience I think can lead to an open mind, and if you can keep your mind open you can learn.

Perhaps the biggest obstacle is admitting that there is someone out there who just knows a lot more. Maybe he's a lot younger but he's just got you beat on knowledge and experience and there's nothing that's going to change that. So will you be taught or will you get emotional? I know for sure that there are a lot of folks who are so closed off to changing opinions that they'll never learn. They never hear and they never progress.

As far as the actual subject at hand, ELD-M all the way!
25 Feb 2018
@ 07:12 am (GMT)

Joshua Mayfield

Re: Ethics of Using Match Bullet
I also had to decide whether to hang onto some sacred cows or let them die in the face of new and more expert information. Well stated, Lane.
04 Aug 2018
@ 05:27 am (GMT)

Aaron Peterson

Re: Ethics of Using Match Bullet
I completely agree. It's a daily struggle.
04 Aug 2018
@ 07:40 am (GMT)

Warwick Marflitt

Re: Ethics of Using Match Bullet
Maybe the Freemasons where onto something. Lol
But "What would I know " I'm just a dumb Auto Electrician!
Knowledge and Learning flows down generations. Like water. From the "Raindrop" to "The river" too "The sea".
The Human mind, Once stretched for a solution. Rarely shrinks back to its Former size....

Here's an interesting talk about being "Taught" or how we Learn? I'm thinking that some of you won't be able to hear this due to international treaties and Geo blocks by internet providers. I am sure that those who can listen will enjoy the story.

https://www.radionz.co.nz/audio/player?audio_id=201828286#
04 Aug 2018
@ 12:36 pm (GMT)

Jim Moseley

Re: Ethics of Using Match Bullet
I've been shooting the Amax for many years in my 7 mag and 243. Game weights range from 80 lbs to 325 lbs. Range from 50 yds to 1100 yds. I can't imagine ever switching to a non-match bullet.

Jim
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