@ 06:49 pm (GMT)
Randall ThomasI own two of the new Ruger Precision Rifles, one in 6.5 Creedmoor, and the other in 308 Winchester. Both shoot into a half minute of accuracy or better, the limit right now being me. Ruger has good information and videos on their site if you want a better understanding of what I'm talking about.
They have the barrel attached with a nut, so to change barrels all you need is a set of go/no-go gauges, and a torque wrench. I've decided to order a couple of extra barrels, in other 308 based chamberings. The rifles are magazine fed, so I am limited to the overal length of the 7.62 NATO / 308 Winchester. The factory barrels are "medium heavy" profiles: 1-inch just in front of the chamber, tapering to 3/4-inch at the muzzle.
I have rifles cambered in 257 Roberts, 257 Ackley Improved, and 35 Whelen. So I don't see a need for any thing in 25 or 35 caliber at this time. (That may change with money availability though, depending on how well the current project works out.) I toyed with a 7-08 but I think it would give me similar ballistics to the 6.5, with no real benefit.
At this time I intend to get: 338 Federal in a "medium heavy" profiles with flutes to lighten it, (for Rocky Mountain Elk); and 243 Winchester in a bull barrel profile, (for general varminting) barrels made. Both at 26-inch length.
Any better ideas or comments?
@ 08:20 pm (GMT)
Re: Ruger Precision Rifle, barrel optionsHi Randall
243W is a handy caliber, I use a 6mm Remington with 100gn Sierra game kings for Fallow Deer with great results.
I used a 338 federal, then built my 358 Winchester. I wasn't impressed with the Federal, love the 358 win.
@ 08:52 pm (GMT)
Re: Ruger Precision Rifle, barrel optionsYou might want to consider the range of bullets and weights for the 7mm-08 compared to the 6.5 Creedmore. If you wanted an elk rifle for moderate range the 160 gr bullets would do the trick for you just fine with a 24 inch barrel.
That being said, the 6.5 Creedmore as well as the 6.5x284 has been used by people locally here on moose, elk and a number of smaller critters out to 500 to 600 meters and has done a decent job assuming your shooting is perfect as well as barrel having the right twist rate for the 140 grain.
At times however, long range shots are not needed as was the case of my 13 year old grand daughter, who calmly touched a large bull elk between the eyes that her father had called in to 35 yards.
I am a long term fan of the .243Winchester but for shooting game, I would say it is limited as to distance to about 350 to 400 meters. I have been recently toying with the idea of building a new .243 using a Remington or clone bolt action, a 24 inch heavy sporter contour BenchMark Barrels barrel with 5R rifling in a 1:8 twist for use of the Hornady 105 grain A-max and a 115 grain bullet for targets at longer distances. Their 6mm/243 barrels have set the 1050 yrd records at a major shoot this year in both 5 and 10 shot the 5 shot group was 2-1/8"
@ 08:56 pm (GMT)
Re: Ruger Precision Rifle, barrel optionsJust curious as to whether you might have to have a new or modified bolt or whatever to deal with the larger case dimensions for that rifle when you add a new barrel onto it>
@ 10:02 pm (GMT)
Re: Ruger Precision Rifle, barrel optionsHi Randal, good to hear that the factory barrels are going well. Ruger has come a long way in recent years, showing a major improvement in overall barrel quality since the release of the Hawkeye rifle.
One thing I need to say guys, is that of late the subject of fast change barrels has been coming more and more to the fore within the realms of my own research and among peers. One of the problems people are beginning to find is that the faster you can change the barrel, the more there is to go wrong. Rifles like this which are a bit slower to change out due to lock nuts and the need for head spacing can at the end of the day prove to be more secure and reliable long term. So there are a few pluses to this type of system.
I also like the fact that as a collapsable rifle, it is the butt that folds away without moving the barrel. I just cannot believe sometimes, that an engineer would come up with barrel removal as a solution for making a take down rifle compact when the butt is the most reliable means of making a rifle compact without effecting the zero.
To be honest, if it was my rifle, I would leave it in .308 and focus on becoming highly proficient with the rig. There is a great deal you can learn within a caliber, such as how different bullets perform on game at varying ranges etc. Being able to change barrels in a relatively painless manner means that you can go all out, wear out a barrel and then replace it and carry on. The more you know the one cartridge the better. There is much to this that I feel unable to discuss here and do not want to go down too many rabbit holes. But in brief, although the .308 will not shoot as flat as your Creedmore, it will teach you a great deal and if you stick with it, it will repay you in kind with a heavy payload. I see no reason to swap between the two. If it were the other way around, the Creedmore would teach you that although this cartridge has a very flat trajectory, trajectories are not the only factor that we have to take into consideration (which crosses over into what Bryan talks about and also the 7mm Practical and Magnums thread).
If you want to effect a great deal of change, I believe you will need to adopt a great change in bore diameter, hence why our friends are suggesting the likes of the .243 and .358 (Bob basing his choice on past experience with the Federal). Who would have a tactical .358? Well, if you read O'Connors early works, the .351 Self loading did prove to be a favorite with police in its day. I am a great fan of accurate .35's for hunting.
The advice offfered by myself and others is obviously just shooting the breeze. Perhaps you want to explore the Federal. Don't let us cramp your experimentation. Having said this, please refer to the cartridges book for potential COAL's for your proposed Federal. It would be a shame to have to single feed it.
@ 10:57 pm (GMT)
Re: Ruger Precision Rifle, barrel optionsWell said Nathan, with you 100%.
Unless your into very long range. The 308W is a great hunting caliber with lots of projectile choices.
I have two Remington 700's set up for barrel swap but never swap them. When your rifle is shooting great I hate altering them. It's nice to be able to pick up your rifle for a long shot and be confident that the first cold shot is spot on.
@ 11:41 pm (GMT)
Re: Ruger Precision Rifle, barrel options
Just curious as to whether you might have to have a new or modified bolt or whatever to deal with the larger case dimensions for that rifle when you add a new barrel onto it>
Since the chamberings I'm looking at are all based on the 308 Winchester, the base of the cartridge will be the same. And, the front shoulder diameter, and location close enough to the 308 that I shouldn't have issues with feeding from the magazine.
@ 11:59 pm (GMT)
Re: Ruger Precision Rifle, barrel optionsMy intent is to shoot the Creedmoor as a long range rifle to develop that skill set, and the 308 out to 500.
To me the 338 Federal makes more sense as a larger caliber because the 358 bore is covered by Ruger 77, in 35 Whelen, which is a sub moa gun with just about every load I've tried from 180 through 250-grains. The best accuracy coming from 225-gr Nosler partitions, and old style Nosler lead tipped solid base bullets.
The 243 is primarily for marmots, also known as rock chucks, and ground squirrels, (not sure if you guys have them down there or not), and as a deer rifle for my daughter who tends to be a bit recoil sensitive still. I want to keep the experience as enjoyable as I can for her. And, a hard recoiling rifle doesn't fit my plan for teaching her to shoot. With the ability to change barrels in about 45-minutes, and the adjustability of the stock to the shooter, I can set up a rifle to fit her in about an hour.
@ 12:16 am (GMT)
Re: Ruger Precision Rifle, barrel optionshi Randall.
the ability to switch barrels on those rugers looks like fun.
if i ever get myself set up with a lathe ill be playing around with few different caliber barrels like yourself and the ruger american looks like a good platform to do so on, i also thought about adding a remington/savage style recoil lug on one.
i have wonder if you can get 460 s&w feeding through them but i doubt the bolt face would be big enough as you have mentioned.
i have heard of a 45/308 wild cat called the 45raptor this requires head spacing off the case mouth much like the 45acp thou.
there also the option to go the other way with a 22/243.
the 308win really is a good caliber that you can't argue with.
if you haven't got Nathans cartridge book i highly recommend having a read of it.
@ 12:52 am (GMT)
Re: Ruger Precision Rifle, barrel optionshmmmmm interesting thread,Ive read a wee bit about .22/243 sounds like a lot of fun for a barrel burner....could double as deer rifle for daughter if you stuck a good barnes TTSX in it and kept range sensible (bit like .243 really)
agree with Nathan's comment on the .308 use it and learn it you COULD do all your asking with just that one barrel...110grn -125grn varmit loads or even 55grn accelerators if you could keep them accurate right through to a good 180 grn for haevier stuff with a 150-165 grn super accurate load for everything in between.
I would set up both rifles for either end of the spectrum and leave it at that...bit like me owning a .223 and a .270...with a .39mm for close bush stalking
@ 09:45 am (GMT)
Re: Ruger Precision Rifle, barrel optionsI thought those Ruger precision rifles would be too heavy for carrying or off hand shots, aren't they designed primarily for competition/varmint, regarding your daughter will she carry it or will you carry it for her? Or do you deer/elk shoot from stands.
You might be better off buying her own rifle that she's able to girl-handle, 6.5 swede is pretty good if you want something a bit more potent than a 243.
They're just starting to take orders for the RPR over here, I wanted one real bad, but when I sat down and thought about it, it doesn't work for what I hunt and how I go about hunting. Nevertheless I'm so jealous
@ 09:47 am (GMT)
Re: Ruger Precision Rifle, barrel optionsIs the bob to hot for her?
@ 04:40 pm (GMT)
Re: Ruger Precision Rifle, barrel optionsFrom the Ruger web site:
308 Win 20" barrel 9.7 pounds
6.5 Creedmoor 24" barrel 10.6 pounds
243 Win 26" barrel 11 pounds
You have to be one tough fellow 😀
@ 07:27 pm (GMT)
Re: Ruger Precision Rifle, barrel optionsDead right Bob, I was thinking about hunting. As a comp rifle, a slippery 6.5 would win out. I suppose much depends on on your end game and whether you want to improve your hunting skill set or target skill set as this effects decisions.
Right in the middle we have the 7mm-08 which has the slippery BC''s of the 6.5 but a similar pay load to the .308 and can be used exceptionally well for both disciplines without having to change barrels, projectiles or take care with shot placement versus bullet choice on a fairly wide range of game. Again you end up with one gun set up and no great need to own several calibers.
I think any ideas I or we have are moot because at the end of the day, we all like to experiment and as I said earlier, if Randall is interested in the .338, this is something he might just need to pursuit to its conclusion.
The weights quoted above are good for teaching young ones, though this is not the same as an actual carry rifle for youths. Riley (9) is carrying (short distances) and shooting (mild loads) my .308 client trainer rifle now which is the same weight. The rifle steadies well, has little recoil and allows her to focus on trigger control etc for clean one shot kills.
Note to Bob and others, I have been seeing the Lapua small primer .308 case put to use in other combos lately and the results are the the same. Like your .358, velocities can at times be boosted a good deal, especially in long barreled rifles (long slow burn / pressure wave). Very interesting.
@ 08:32 pm (GMT)
Re: Ruger Precision Rifle, barrel optionsJust some thoughts as l have zero experience with this type of barrel swap setup....
How repeatable is the head spacing reset? Within a few thou?, can you replicate it using the go gauge every time?
With precision reloading for LR the last thing l would want is the head space walking around after barrel swaps.
Try and re-set the valve clearance on an engine using a feeler gauge (go-no go gauge!!) the same every time.......... You will have a different feel (clearance) on many of the cylinders using the same gauge!
Depending on reloading style used, FL cases with a good bump may show little difference. Anyway just some random thoughts!
@ 03:34 pm (GMT)
Re: Ruger Precision Rifle, barrel optionsNot to hijack this thread, but a quick comment to Bryan: I picked up the exact barrel in Houston (in stock). It is a beauty.