cart SHOPPING CART You have 0 items
SELECT CURRENCY

Discussion Forums

1
Search forums
Forum Index > Rifles general discussion > howa model 1500 223 modifications

howa model 1500 223 modifications

09 Nov 2019
@ 10:50 am (GMT)

Cam Stothers

[/img]https://imgur.com/gallery/Dw2WzOO[img]

Just discovered a large quantity of tapered composite tubing that, I believe, is going to be perfect for stabilising my stock. If you don’t have any in your shed, the local Chinese rubbish shop has racks of it at a reasonable cost!

Hi, I’m cam and, I’m new to the terminal ballistics crowd. Engineer by trade and confident with any fabrication project so I’m going to have a go at bedding / destroying my stock 😀

I’ll post some more pictures of how the old fishing rod installation into the Howa synthetic stock goes.

I’m new to hunting and shooting, having spent the last 30 years pursuing the sea and river in search of tasty morsels, but I’ve always had an interest in and wanted to do more with firearms. I’m not the sort of person that is content with only knowing the basics of a subject (a significant portion of people that know me would, rudely, refer to me as a know it all) so I am aggressively learning / researching but quickly figuring out that this shooting subject is large!!

I bought a Howa m1500 mini .223 about 4 years ago, kind of on a whim, and haven’t done a lot with it until the last few months, so with the aid of my brother, who has been doing this hunting shooting stuff while I’ve been chasing fish, I’m about to start loading so I figure step one is make the Howa the best it can be. It’s grouping well within an inch at 100 with various factory loads, and would be within an inch at 200 I think but my inability to shoot a group hasn’t proved this. I seem to get two in an inch and then I’ll flinch / push / move / laterally and the third will be at 2” ( I’m right handed but blind in my right eye, so am forced to shoot left handed, which I’m improving at every time I pick a rifle up, I’ve also got a slug gun stock with some weights in it that I walk around the house with to increase my left arm strength / muscle memory!)

Anyway, great site with a lot of good information, I’m sure to have lots of questions as I “make maHowa great again”

Replies

1
10 Nov 2019
@ 05:23 am (GMT)

Paul Leverman

Re: howa model 1500 223 modifications
Why not do it the easy way? Sometimes "new" isn't always "better", and it may not be "better", it may just be time consuming. But I like to play, too, so let's see how this goes.
10 Nov 2019
@ 09:08 am (GMT)

Nathan Foster

Re: howa model 1500 223 modifications
Hi Cam, welcome aboard. The trick with the Howa is to take it step by step. There is a lot of work to do besides bedding, the books cover each of the steps.

regarding the Howa Mini, the things to watch for are:

Issues with the temper of the ultra light barrel. This rifle was made for the whimp generation so its ultra light and can display problems with heat stress in the barrel. Work on your technique but be mindful that fliers may be a result of temper issues. Therefore if the rifle appears to be producing a 1" main group with some fliers that go out to 2", call it for what it is - a gun that is currently grouping 2". Its going to take some time to work out whether its you or the rifle but it may just be the rifle.

Issues with machining. Besides some rough machining at the chamber (throat), I have recently seen some rough machining at the lug rebates. The following applies to all of my readers - please be careful when working around the lugs, be mindful of burrs, be ultra careful with lapping. If a light lap does not feel right or if anything seems even remotely 'off', have the barrel pulled, have the lugs lapped with the barrel off. To all - I am not generally used to seeing rougher rifle machining from Japan, nor the use of worn reamers but am now seeing a bit of this. I find this quite odd considering that Japan is a major producer of cutting tools (Kyocera etc).

Our stabilizer kits cost very little, they are a simple fix for the forend. Bedding at the knox will tie all of this in. The greater challenge you face is getting the bedding to work at the upper sidewalls of the stock which consist entirely of rubber on the Hogue stock design. In the area of the action, you will need to trim away some of the stock sidewall. A very sharp craft knife (box cutter) can prove useful for this but you have to take great care. After this, carbon or glass fiber can be mixed with our bedding compound to provide directional rather than compression strength at the upper sidewalls. Again, all of this is covered in the Accurizing book. The web bedding instructions may also cover some of this.

Above all, bungee tension will determine whether your job is a success or a complete bust. The Hogue has flex points within the area of the action that you cannot pre-stiffen. It is imperative that your bungee tension (during the bedding cure) is only just tight enough to secure the action in place without any excessive force. A long barrel channel dam can help this a good deal.

Many of my readers utilize the inexpensive Howa / Hogue as their first time accurizing job. Unfortunately, bedding the Hogue is not the easiest of jobs but it can be done. Time, patience and attention to prep are the main factors.
10 Nov 2019
@ 01:04 pm (GMT)

Cam Stothers

Re: howa model 1500 223 modifications
Thanks for the detailed reply, I’ve put in a request to Santa for your literature, so maybe the plan should be to keep using it, as is, for now and add your bedding Products to the Santa list, maybe I should bed my krico 22 as practice first?
Is it obvious that the hogue stock is rubberised? I’m almost certain, upon inspection, that my stock is entirely plastic, it may be ignorance that I think it is a hogue.
Concern for reliance on resin alone / glassing directly to the rubber / some mention of utilising a carbon arrow shaft to assist in stabilisation is what has led me down this path

However, this wouldn’t be the first time I’d over thought something and will abandon it if it’s unnecessary.
I have just started having an issue with the bolt binding at full aft, a thorough clean has improved it but there is a noticeable burr on the lug with the slot in it, and an uneven wear indication / gall mark on the other lug, I think a light lap will recover it. I am wondering whether a factor in this is because I bring my right, slung, forehand back to work the bolt, I put quite uneven pressure on the bolt, because I end up with a weird chicken wing thing going on. I plan to start reaching over with my left hand instead.
10 Nov 2019
@ 05:12 pm (GMT)

Scott Struif

Re: howa model 1500 223 modifications
Hi, Cam. If the gun is grouping "well within an inch at 100," as you said, don't mess with it.
10 Nov 2019
@ 07:14 pm (GMT)

Cam Stothers

Re: howa model 1500 223 modifications
Hi Scott,

It depends what you want I guess, considering Howa guarantee sub moa in all rifles purchased after 01/01/2017, less than a year after I bought mine, 1” @ 300 or a clean hole at 100 should be easily achievable, and if it’s only accurate to 100, it’s just a 22. Maybe it’s a waste of time, but I’d like to put the effort in and see what it’s capable of, if only for the experience, sure I’m new to the game, but I’m well and truly bitten and intend to invest a lot of time trying to perfect, every office girls wet dream, a hands free hole punch.
11 Nov 2019
@ 09:30 am (GMT)

Scott Struif

Re: howa model 1500 223 modifications
Hi, Cam. Gotcha. I have one of the lightweight, pencil-barrel 1500s, and also a sporter-barrel model. The latter shoots MOA. If the former shot as well as your gun, I'd consider myself lucky. I've relegated it to woods hunting, 150 yards max, and it's fine for that. Let us know how your project turns out. I might be inspired to put in some effort on mine.
11 Nov 2019
@ 09:45 am (GMT)

Nathan Foster

Re: howa model 1500 223 modifications
Hi Cam, once you cut into it, you will see that a major proportion of the sidewall at the action is pure rubber with no plastic behind it. If you study the stock as it is now, you will see the seam where there plastic stops and the rubber begins. As suggested, just go slowly with it, one step at a time.

The stabilizer product works. Folk who use arrow shafts generally do so without having used our product. Any remaining flex is not as a result of a weak forend but as a result of flex points at the action, tied off via bedding. This is discussed on the product instruction pages. If our product didn't work, I wouldn't sell it. Our business is based on hard work and dedication to the shooting community.

Yes, just go carefully with the lugs as per previous comments.

I think you could carry on with this rather than the Krico. As I said earlier, many guys utilize this rifle as their first time project. If you muck up the bedding, you can start over again.

When learning, it pays to do your prep on Saturday, but wait until Sunday morning (when you are fresh) to place the action into the mortice. Try not to cram the whole job into one day during this first attempt.
1
 

ABOUT US

We are a small, family run business, based out of Taranaki, New Zealand, who specialize in cartridge research and testing, and rifle accurizing.

store