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> 25 souper aka 25-308
25 souper aka 25-308
@ 11:51 pm (GMT) |
Riki Waughgood evening all, have just had my Ruger mk 2 re-barreled to 25 souper and a set of dies made by simplex australia, problem bolt not closing on dummy round, when i check specs on this forum i am nowhere near them.they areE 7.19mm F 40mm G 7.17mm H 52.07mm specs on this site are E 6.53 mm F35.4mm G 6.17 H 51.43mm I was hoping somebody might be able to mic their cartridges and let me know which are right. Tks again |
Replies
@ 07:49 am (GMT) |
Nathan FosterRe: 25 souper aka 25-308Hi Riki, my measurements are from a very old style of cartridge. I think I will change these following this. Your measurements should be basically the same as a .243 in most dmensions.Chances are, the die is extruding the case, making the base to shoulder measurement .4mm longer than it should be. An unfired .243 case should in theory feed into the chamber just fine. I generally use Hornady neck dies for initial forming of a basic wildcat. That way I do not mess with the case body. |
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@ 09:46 am (GMT) |
Riki WaughRe: 25 souper aka 25-308tks for reply i think your right, i just trimmed a case and it fits with minor bolt force so have left it at that will work on it some more today. will post results.do you have a 25 souper |
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@ 09:52 am (GMT) |
Riki WaughRe: 25 souper aka 25-308just checked and an unfired .243 case doesnt fit!!! |
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@ 10:16 am (GMT) |
Nathan FosterRe: 25 souper aka 25-308I do not have a Souper at the moment, nor any .303 wildcats. One of our other forum members has just had his .243 rebarreled to .25-08, simply because the previous .243 barrel was too short and he had a pile of .25 pills that needed to be used. Funny how these things happen in runs. In any case, its always hard to say what the exact dimensions will be from reamer to reamer. You will have to take it very carefully.If the .243 case did not fit, then we can guess that the reamer was not based on the .243. Yours may have slightly more body taper. It could be binding just behind the shoulder. Very hard to say. It may pay to also check the bolt lugs on your rifle. If the lugs have not been lapped, you can DIY this as per the books and chances are, this may ease up the chamber. Do keep in mind that any form of internet diagnosis can be rife with errors. Without seeing the rifle, I can only guess as to what is causing what. Your smith should be able to determine what is wrong. |
@ 01:33 am (GMT) |
Paul LevermanRe: 25 souper aka 25-308You, or your smith, can take a chamber casting to get the exact chamber measurements. Then you can compare these to new or resized cases. Without having both sets of measurements, it's kind of a guessing game as to which is the one causing grief. As Nathan said, proceed with extreme caution. |
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@ 09:57 am (GMT) |
Nathan FosterRe: 25 souper aka 25-308OK, have cleaned up those numbers to reflect a basic .243 variant of the wildcat which is again, just one possible version. Thanks Paul for checking over my math and emailing me, much appreciated. |
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@ 11:53 am (GMT) |
Riki WaughRe: 25 souper aka 25-308tks to you both, have seen revised dimensions, i am close but no cigar, its off to gunsmith will keep in touch |
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@ 05:52 pm (GMT) |
Paul LevermanRe: 25 souper aka 25-308With all those numbers floating around in your head, there has to be some conflict somewhere. It wasn't the math itself, just looking at them took a while and the diameters didn't seem right and the neck was bigger than the junction.....just not right.....but didn't know what. Then put conversion into it...do you divide by 25.4 or multiply?.....I honestly don't know how you could possibly keep a handle on it. Personally, I find the Brick Wall method the best. Sit and stare for a couple of hours and you find the break in the pattern. |
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@ 09:06 pm (GMT) |
Riki WaughRe: 25 souper aka 25-308after resetting dies my dummy rounds now chamber with slight bolt force, i was thinking then fire formed cases might chamber easier, question,,,,,,,,, can i then neck size only. |
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@ 12:25 pm (GMT) |
Riki WaughRe: 25 souper aka 25-308G'day all, have just fired 6 rounds, bolt was hard to close on 3 easy on 3 then all cycled easy after firing, my question may sound strange but you know more than me.I have 100 loaded .243 bullets I dont need can I fire them in 25 Souper to get rid of them and fireforn cases at same time, will it hurt my new barrel. I'm not in favour of it but a friend says OK, I dont need the brass |
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@ 01:48 am (GMT) |
Paul LevermanRe: 25 souper aka 25-308I'm trying to figure out if I am reading your question right. Please correct me if I have misread or misinterpret your intentions.You want to take a loaded 243 Winchester round, chamber it into a rifle that has been chambered for 25 Souper (25-308), and pull the trigger? It probably won't hurt your new barrel, but your wife will probably end up with a new husband. Oh, and by the way, get a new friend. |
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@ 02:10 am (GMT) |
Paul LevermanRe: 25 souper aka 25-308After re-reading my above post, I realised I never answered your question: NO, DO NOT DO THISIf you read again Nathans post, he says, "... has just had his .243 rebarreled to .25-08, simply because the previous .243 barrel was too short and he had a pile of .25 pills... ". Read this again. The Knowledge Base here has this to say, "...to neck down the .308 to .257...”. Read this again. Do you understand what they are talking about? Look again at the diameters of bullets versus the bore diameters. If you do not understand where the problem lies in your plan to fire 243Win ammo in your 25-308, maybe you should take up another hobby. My apologies if I sound rude, but there are some basic rules of firearms that you have never bothered to learn. |
@ 10:50 am (GMT) |
Bob MavinRe: 25 souper aka 25-308RikiYou CAN fire a 243 round in a 25-08, no problem, same chamber, small diameter projectile in a larger diameter bore equals less pressure and a case that matches your chamber |
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@ 01:02 pm (GMT) |
Bob MavinRe: 25 souper aka 25-308Riki.To back up my statement above. We've been fire forming wildcats to larger dia calibers for years. Not as accurate as having a projectile jammed ( to center case) into the lands, but it still does a good job. Bob |
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@ 05:20 pm (GMT) |
Paul LevermanRe: 25 souper aka 25-308I stand corrected. Apparently, Rikki, I was mistaken. You can take any cartridge that fits the chamber and fire it as long as the bullet is smaller than the bore. Apparently, it doesn't matter what the stamping is on the barrel. Nor does it matter which reamer the chamber is cut with. I guess I had better go back and re-read and re-learn right from the beginning. My apologies for trying to be informative about something I obviously know nothing about. |
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@ 06:37 pm (GMT) |
Riki WaughRe: 25 souper aka 25-308Paul please dont apologise, and thank you Bob, my main concern is damaging the barrel and saving the trouble of pulling 100 projectiles, have plugged cases with potato before to fireform but not an undersize projectile |
@ 12:22 pm (GMT) |
Fred LawlerRe: 25 souper aka 25-308I have just built a 25 souper on a Rem700,Hart barrel and headspaced on a 308 gauge and I have also fired 243 factory rounds through it with no inkling of damage to the throat or bore according to my Hawkeye borescope . |
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@ 02:19 pm (GMT) |
Riki WaughRe: 25 souper aka 25-308tks very much that will kill two birds with one stone (hopefully not me). if you have time would appreciate some load data if possible and your opinion of the 25Souper. mine is RugerMk2 TSE sporter barrel feels and balances well. |
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@ 07:24 pm (GMT) |
Riki WaughRe: 25 souper aka 25-308Day 2 at range. last week fireformed some with 43grn 2209 today loaded 5 each 46grn 2209 and 47grn 2209 both shot .75" 100yds but bolt still very stiff to close on some mainly PMC, Winchester are easier but will keep working on this.Max COAL to lands is 2.710" so loaded 2.660" will try and get closer to lands as they just look stubby, sorry was using 90grn Sierra Blitzking. waiting for 90grn Gameking to arrive.Tks for your help. |
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@ 07:31 pm (GMT) |
Riki WaughRe: 25 souper aka 25-308a quick update, this outfit is (was) going well...5 inch with 90 gr sierra blitzking then when i got the sierra 90grn HP gameking ran into feed problems. the flat hollowpoint is just hitting side of chamber. Off to gunsmith tomorrow think problem is feed rails? rifle was re-barreled from 22-250 to 25 souper (308 case). will post outcome but if someone has opinion plse let me know. tks again |
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